Then if you go to the author’s footnote number 6 listed above, you find Dr. Talbot saying:

“In my judgment, the exegetical considerations supporting the traditional doctrine are somewhat better than those against it.” See, for instance, Kendall S. Harmon, “The Case Against Conditionalism: A response to Edward William Fudge,” in Cameron, ed., op. cit.”

So, if even an author who is making a good case for eternal punishment, can show enough grace to say that the exegetical considerations are only somewhat better for his position than those who disagree with him, then I can hardly see an argument for dividing with other Christians over this issue.

I purchased the book by Dr. Hughes entitled “The True Image: The Origin and Destiny of Man in Christ”. It can be purchased here:

http://www.marshillaudio.org/resources/article.asp?id=89

It is a well written book on systematic theology as well as church history. J.I. Packer endorses the book with the following: “In this wide-ranging biblical, historical, and theological study a versatile veteran makes convincing use of the concept of the divine image to integrate the doctrines of man and Christ. His biblical bases are solid, his expositions weighty, and his historical interactions judicious and enlightening. This is a very valuable piece of work”

Sinclair B. Ferguson, a former colleague of Hughes while teaching at Westminster Theological Seminary also endorsed the book as follows: “We have come to expect both solid learning and exquisite literary style from Philip E. Hughes. “The True Image’ is no exception. Indeed it is a remarkable piece of work, quarried from a lifetime of study in Biblical exegesis, systematic theology, and church history. It is encyclopedic in its discussion of anthropology and Christology and their mutual relationship. The novitiate will find it instructive, while the theologically advanced will discover comprehensive exposition married to a scholarly judgment that sometimes resurrects classical views, sometimes provides the unexpected, and on occasion surprises with the controversial.”

I am sure that last statement refers to Hughes views on eventual annihilation. However, it should be remembered that Hughes view is not similar to the SDA view in many ways. He clearly is orthodox on the view of the human spirit, and he believes in the intermediate state, and not soul sleep. He does believe that Jesus’ parable in Luke 16 speaks of the wicked in chains waiting the final judgment, depicts accurately the doctrine of Hades. His contention is that in the new heavens and new earth, Death and Hades will be cast finally into the Lake of fire and destroyed completely.

I think his arguments are well worth considering, and comparing with more traditional views. That is why I decided to take the time to type chapter 37 that deals with this topic and present it for your consideration. I haven’t finally made up my mind on this, but at least I am less dogmatic than before after studying this scholar’s arguments.

Stan

I have to post this list in multiple posts, due to the length being over the character limit per post.

Abbreviations used:

“Heb.” = Hebrew

“Gr.” = Greek

“lit.” = literally

1. Man was created in the image of God with an immaterial spirit/soul (within the material body):

Genesis 1:27: “God created [Heb. ”bara”] man in His own image, in the image of God He created [Heb. ”bara”] him; male and female He created [Heb. ”bara”] them.” (NASB.) cf. John 4:24: “God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.” (NASB.) cf. Genesis 2:7: “Then the LORD God formed [Heb. ”yatsar”] man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.” (NASB.)

Genesis 2:16-17: “The LORD God commanded the man, saying, ‘From any tree of the garden you may eat freely;
but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die.’” (NASB.)

Genesis 6:3: “Then the LORD said, ‘My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he also is flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.’” (NASB.)

Genesis 27:4 (also in verses 19, 25, 31): “and prepare a savory dish for me such as I love, and bring it to me that I may eat, so that my soul may bless you before I die.” (NASB.)

Genesis 34:3, 8: “And his soul was drawn to Dinah the daughter of Jacob. He loved the young woman and spoke tenderly to her. [...] But Hamor spoke with them, saying, ‘The soul of my son Shechem longs for your daughter. Please give her to him to be his wife.” (ESV.)

Genesis 41:8: “Now in the morning his spirit was troubled, so he sent and called for all the magicians of Egypt, and all its wise men. And Pharaoh told them his dreams, but there was no one who could interpret them to Pharaoh.” (NASB.)

Genesis 42:21: “Then they said to one another, ‘Truly we are guilty concerning our brother, because we saw the distress of his soul when he pleaded with us, yet we would not listen; therefore this distress has come upon us.’” (NASB.)

Genesis 45:27: “When they told him all the words of Joseph that he had spoken to them, and when he saw the wagons that Joseph had sent to carry him, the spirit of their father Jacob revived.”

Genesis 49:6: “Let my soul not enter into their council;
Let not my glory be united with their assembly;
Because in their anger they slew men,
And in their self-will they lamed oxen.” (NASB.)

Exodus 35:21: “Everyone whose heart stirred him and everyone whose spirit moved him came and brought the LORD’S contribution for the work of the tent of meeting and for all its service and for the holy garments.” (NASB.)

Leviticus 16:29, 31: “‘This shall be a permanent statute for you: in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall humble your souls and not do any work, whether the native, or the alien who sojourns among you; [...] ‘It is to be a sabbath of solemn rest for you, that you may humble your souls; it is a permanent statute.” (NASB.)

Leviticus 19:28 (also in 21:1): “‘You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead [lit. “soul"] nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves: I am the LORD.” (NASB.)

Leviticus 26:15-16: “if, instead, you reject My statutes, and if your soul abhors My ordinances so as not to carry out all My commandments, and so break My covenant,
I, in turn, will do this to you: I will appoint over you a sudden terror, consumption and fever that will waste away the eyes and cause the soul to pine away; also, you will sow your seed uselessly, for your enemies will eat it up.” (NASB.)

Leviticus 26:43: “‘For the land will be abandoned by them, and will make up for its sabbaths while it is made desolate without them. They, meanwhile, will be making amends for their iniquity, because they rejected My ordinances and their soul abhorred My statutes.” (NASB.)

Numbers 16:22: “But they fell on their faces and said, ‘O God, God of the spirits of all flesh, when one man sins, will You be angry with the entire congregation?’” (NASB.)

Numbers 21:4-5: “Then they journeyed from Mount Hor by the Way of the Red Sea, to go around the land of Edom; and the soul of the people became very discouraged on the way. And the people spoke against God and against Moses: ‘Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and our soul loathes this worthless bread.’” (NKJV.)

Numbers 27:16: “May the LORD, the God of the spirits of all flesh, appoint a man over the congregation,” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 2:30: “But Sihon king of Heshbon was not willing for us to pass through his land; for the LORD your God hardened his spirit and made his heart obstinate, in order to deliver him into your hand, as he is today.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 4:29: “‘But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 6:5: “‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 10:12: “‘Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul,” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 11:13, 18: “‘It shall come about, if you listen obediently to my commandments which I am commanding you today, to love the LORD your God and to serve Him with all your heart and all your soul, [...] ‘You shall therefore impress these words of mine on your heart and on your soul; and you shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontals on your forehead.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 12:15, 20-21: “Notwithstanding thou mayest kill and eat flesh in all thy gates, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, according to the blessing of the LORD thy God which he hath given thee: the unclean and the clean may eat thereof, as of the roebuck, and as of the hart. [...] When the LORD thy God shall enlarge thy border, as he hath promised thee, and thou shalt say, I will eat flesh, because thy soul longeth to eat flesh; thou mayest eat flesh, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after. If the place which the LORD thy God hath chosen to put his name there be too far from thee, then thou shalt kill of thy herd and of thy flock, which the LORD hath given thee, as I have commanded thee, and thou shalt eat in thy gates whatsoever thy soul lusteth after.” (KJV.)

Deuteronomy 13:3: “you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the LORD your God is testing you to find out if you love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 14:26: “And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the LORD thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,” (KJV.)

Deuteronomy 26:16: “‘This day the LORD your God commands you to do these statutes and ordinances. You shall therefore be careful to do them with all your heart and with all your soul.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 28:65: “‘Among those nations you shall find no rest, and there will be no resting place for the sole of your foot; but there the LORD will give you a trembling heart, failing of eyes, and despair of soul.” (NASB.)

Deuteronomy 30:2, 6, 10: “and you return to the LORD your God and obey Him with all your heart and soul according to all that I command you today, you and your sons, [...] ‘Moreover the LORD your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, so that you may live. [...] if you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, if you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul.” (NASB.)

Joshua 22:5: “‘Only be very careful to observe the commandment and the law which Moses the servant of the LORD commanded you, to love the LORD your God and walk in all His ways and keep His commandments and hold fast to Him and serve Him with all your heart and with all your soul.’” (NASB.)

Joshua 23:14: “‘Now behold, today I am going the way of all the earth, and you know in all your hearts and in all your souls that not one word of all the good words which the LORD your God spoke concerning you has failed; all have been fulfilled for you, not one of them has failed.” (NASB.)

Judges 5:21: “‘The torrent of Kishon swept them away,
The ancient torrent, the torrent Kishon.
O my soul, march on with strength.” (NASB.)

Judges 16:16: “It came about when she pressed him daily with her words and urged him, that his soul was annoyed to death.” (NASB.)

1 Samuel 1:10: “And she was in bitterness of soul, and prayed to the LORD and wept in anguish.” (NKVJ.)

1 Samuel 1:15: “But Hannah replied, ‘No, my lord, I am a woman oppressed in spirit; I have drunk neither wine nor strong drink, but I have poured out my soul before the LORD.” (NASB.)

1 Samuel 2:16: “And if any man said unto him, Let them not fail to burn the fat presently, and then take as much as thy soul desireth; then he would answer him, Nay; but thou shalt give it me now: and if not, I will take it by force.” (KJV.)

1 Samuel 2:33: “‘Yet I will not cut off every man of yours from My altar so that your eyes will fail from weeping and your soul grieve, and all the increase of your house will die in the prime of life.” (NASB.)

1 Samuel 18:1: “Now it came about when he had finished speaking to Saul, that the soul of Jonathan was knit to the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as himself.” (NASB.)

1 Samuel 20:4: “Then said Jonathan unto David, Whatsoever thy soul desireth, I will even do it for thee.” (KJV.)

1 Samuel 23:20: “‘Now then, O king, come down according to all the desire of your soul to do so; and our part shall be to surrender him into the king’s hand.’” (NASB.)

1 Samuel 30:6: “Now David was greatly distressed, for the people spoke of stoning him, because the soul of all the people was grieved, every man for his sons and his daughters. But David strengthened himself in the LORD his God.” (NKJV.)

2 Samuel 1:9: “‘And he saith unto me, Stand, I pray thee, over me, and put me to death, for seized me hath the arrow, for all my soul [is] still in me.” (YLT.)

2 Samuel 3:21: “Abner said to David, ‘Let me arise and go and gather all Israel to my lord the king, that they may make a covenant with you, and that you may be king over all that your soul desires.’ So David sent Abner away, and he went in peace.” (NASB.)

2 Samuel 5:8: “David said on that day, ‘Whoever would strike the Jebusites, let him reach the lame and the blind, who are hated by David’s soul, through the water tunnel.’ Therefore they say, ‘The blind or the lame shall not come into the house.’” (NASB.)

2 Samuel 11:11: “Uriah said to David, ‘The ark and Israel and Judah are staying in temporary shelters, and my lord Joab and the servants of my lord are camping in the open field. Shall I then go to my house to eat and to drink and to lie with my wife? By your life and the life of your soul, I will not do this thing.’” (NASB.)

1 Kings 2:4: “so that the LORD may carry out His promise which He spoke concerning me, saying, ‘If your sons are careful of their way, to walk before Me in truth with all their heart and with all their soul, you shall not lack a man on the throne of Israel.’” (NASB.)

1 Kings 8:48 (repeated in 2 Chronicles 6:38): “if they return to You with all their heart and with all their soul in the land of their enemies who have taken them captive, and pray to You toward their land which You have given to their fathers, the city which You have chosen, and the house which I have built for Your name;” (NASB.)

1 Kings 11:37: “And I will take thee, and thou shalt reign according to all that thy soul desireth, and shalt be king over Israel.” (KJV.)

1 Kings 21:5: “But Jezebel his wife came to him and said to him, ‘How is it that your spirit is so sullen that you are not eating food?’” (NASB.)

2 Kings 4:27: “When she came to the man of God to the hill, she caught hold of his feet. And Gehazi came near to push her away; but the man of God said, ‘Let her alone, for her soul is troubled within her; and the LORD has hidden it from me and has not told me.’” (NASB.)

2 Kings 23:3 (repeated in 2 Chronicles 34:31), 25: “The king stood by the pillar and made a covenant before the LORD, to walk after the LORD, and to keep His commandments and His testimonies and His statutes with all his heart and all his soul, to carry out the words of this covenant that were written in this book. And all the people entered into the covenant. [...] Before him there was no king like him who turned to the LORD with all his heart and with all his soul and with all his might, according to all the law of Moses; nor did any like him arise after him.” (NASB.)

1 Chronicles 5:26: “So the God of Israel stirred up the spirit of Pul, king of Assyria, even the spirit of Tilgath-pilneser king of Assyria, and he carried them away into exile, namely the Reubenites, the Gadites and the half-tribe of Manasseh, and brought them to Halah, Habor, Hara and to the river of Gozan, to this day.” (NASB.)

1 Chronicles 22:19: “‘Now set your heart and your soul to seek the LORD your God; arise, therefore, and build the sanctuary of the LORD God, so that you may bring the ark of the covenant of the LORD and the holy vessels of God into the house that is to be built for the name of the LORD.’” (NASB.)

2 Chronicles 15:12: “They entered into the covenant to seek the LORD God of their fathers with all their heart and soul;” (NASB.)

2 Chronicles 36:22 (repeated in Ezra 1:1): “Now in the first year of Cyrus king of Persia--in order to fulfill the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah--the LORD stirred up the spirit of Cyrus king of Persia, so that he sent a proclamation throughout his kingdom, and also put it in writing, saying,” (NASB.)

Ezra 1:5: “Then the heads of fathers’ households of Judah and Benjamin and the priests and the Levites arose, even everyone whose spirit God had stirred to go up and rebuild the house of the LORD which is in Jerusalem.” (NASB.)

Esther 4:13: “and Mordecai speaketh to send back unto Esther: ‘Do not think in thy soul to be delivered [in] the house of the king, more than all the Jews,” (YLT.)

Job 3:20: “‘Why is light given to him who suffers,
And life to the bitter of soul,” (NASB.)

Job 4:15-19: “Then a spirit passed by my face;
The hair of my flesh bristled up.
‘It stood still, but I could not discern its appearance;
A form was before my eyes;
There was silence, then I heard a voice:
‘Can mankind be just before God?
Can a man be pure before his Maker?
‘He puts no trust even in His servants;
And against His angels He charges error.
‘How much more those who dwell in houses of clay,
Whose foundation is in the dust,
Who are crushed before the moth!” (NASB.)

Job 6:4, 7: “For the arrows of the Almighty are within me,
Their poison my spirit drinks;
The terrors of God are arrayed against me. [...] ‘My soul refuses to touch them;
They are like loathsome food to me.” (NASB.)

Job 7:11, 15: “Therefore I will not restrain my mouth;
I will speak in the anguish of my spirit,
I will complain in the bitterness of my soul. [...] So that my soul would choose suffocation,
Death rather than my pains.” (NASB.)

Job 10:1: “‘My soul loathes my life;
I will give free course to my complaint,
I will speak in the bitterness of my soul.” (NKJV.)

Job 10:12: “‘You have granted me life and lovingkindness;
And Your care has preserved my spirit.” (NASB.)

Job 14:22: “Only—his flesh for him is pained, And his soul for him doth mourn.’” (YLT.)

Job 15:12-13: “Why does your heart carry you away?
And why do your eyes flash,
That you should turn your spirit against God
And allow such words to go out of your mouth?” (NASB.)

Job 19:2: “‘How long will you torment my soul,
And break me in pieces with words?” (NKJV.)

Job 21:25: “While another dies with a bitter soul,
Never even tasting anything good.” (NASB.)

Job 24:12: “‘From the city men groan,
And the souls of the wounded cry out;
Yet God does not pay attention to folly.” (NASB.)

Job 27:2: “‘As God lives, who has taken away my right,
And the Almighty, who has embittered my soul,” (NASB.)

Job 30:16, 25: “‘And now my soul is poured out within me;
Days of affliction have seized me. [...] ‘Have I not wept for the one whose life is hard?
Was not my soul grieved for the needy?” (NASB.)

Job 32:8, 18: “But there is a spirit in man,
And the breath of the Almighty gives him understanding. [...] For I am full of words;
The spirit within me compels me.” (NKJV.)

Job 33:18-22, 24, 28-30: “He keeps back his soul from the Pit,
And his life from perishing by the sword.
‘Man is also chastened with pain on his bed,
And with strong pain in many of his bones,
So that his life abhors bread,
And his soul succulent food.
His flesh wastes away from sight,
And his bones stick out which once were not seen.
Yes, his soul draws near the Pit,
And his life to the executioners. [...] Then He is gracious to him, and says,
‘Deliver him from going down to the Pit;
I have found a ransom’; [...] He will redeem his soul from going down to the Pit,
And his life shall see the light.
‘Behold, God works all these things,
Twice, in fact, three times with a man,
To bring back his soul from the Pit,
That he may be enlightened with the light of life.” (NKJV.)

Job 38:36: “Who has put wisdom in the innermost being
Or given understanding to the mind?” (NASB.)

Psalm 6:2-3: “Have mercy on me, O LORD, for I am weak;
O LORD, heal me, for my bones are troubled.
My soul also is greatly troubled;
But You, O LORD—how long?” (NKJV.)

Psalm 10:3: “Because the wicked hath boasted Of the desire of his soul, And a dishonest gainer he hath blessed, He hath despised Jehovah.” (YLT.)

Psalm 11:1: “In the LORD I take refuge;
How can you say to my soul, ‘Flee as a bird to your mountain;” (NASB.)

Psalm 13:2: “How long shall I take counsel in my soul,
Having sorrow in my heart all the day?
How long will my enemy be exalted over me?” (NASB.)

Psalm 16:10: “For You will not leave my soul in Sheol,
Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.” (NKJV.)

Psalm 19:7: “The law of the LORD is perfect, restoring the soul;
The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.” (NASB.)

Psalm 23:3: “He restores my soul;
He guides me in the paths of righteousness
For His name’s sake.” (NASB.)

Psalm 24:4: “He who has clean hands and a pure heart,
Who has not lifted up his soul to falsehood
And has not sworn deceitfully.” (NASB.)

Psalm 25:1, 13, 20: “To You, O LORD, I lift up my soul. [...] His soul will abide in prosperity,
And his descendants will inherit the land. [...] Guard my soul and deliver me;
Do not let me be ashamed, for I take refuge in You.” (NASB.)

Psalm 26:9: “Do not take my soul away along with sinners,
Nor my life with men of bloodshed,” (NASB.)

Psalm 31:5, 7, 9: “Into Your hand I commit my spirit;
You have ransomed me, O LORD, God of truth. [...] I will rejoice and be glad in Your lovingkindness,
Because You have seen my affliction;
You have known the troubles of my soul, [...] Be gracious to me, O LORD, for I am in distress;
My eye is wasted away from grief, my soul and my body also.” (NASB.)

Psalm 32:2: “How blessed is the man to whom the LORD does not impute iniquity,
And in whose spirit there is no deceit!” (NASB.)

Psalm 33:19-20: “To deliver their soul from death
And to keep them alive in famine.
Our soul waits for the LORD;
He is our help and our shield.” (NASB.)

Psalm 34:2, 22: “My soul will make its boast in the LORD;
The humble will hear it and rejoice. [...] The LORD redeems the soul of His servants,
And none of those who take refuge in Him will be condemned.” (NASB.)

Psalm 35:3, 7-9, 12-13, 17:"Draw also the spear and the battle-axe to meet those who pursue me;
Say to my soul, ‘I am your salvation.’ [...] For without cause they hid their net for me;
Without cause they dug a pit for my soul.
Let destruction come upon him unawares,
And let the net which he hid catch himself;
Into that very destruction let him fall.
And my soul shall rejoice in the LORD;
It shall exult in His salvation. [...] They repay me evil for good,
To the bereavement of my soul.
But as for me, when they were sick, my clothing was sackcloth;
I humbled my soul with fasting,
And my prayer kept returning to my bosom. [...] Lord, how long will You look on?
Rescue my soul from their ravages,
My only life from the lions.” (NASB.)

Psalm 41:4: “As for me, I said, ‘O LORD, be gracious to me;
Heal my soul, for I have sinned against You.’” (NASB.)

Psalm 42:1-2, 4-7, 11: “As the deer pants for the water brooks,
So my soul pants for You, O God.
My soul thirsts for God, for the living God;
When shall I come and appear before God? [...] These things I remember and I pour out my soul within me
For I used to go along with the throng and lead them in procession to the house of God,
With the voice of joy and thanksgiving, a multitude keeping festival.
Why are you in despair, O my soul?
And why have you become disturbed within me?
Hope in God, for I shall again praise Him
For the help of His presence.
O my God, my soul is in despair within me;
Therefore I remember You from the land of the Jordan
And the peaks of Hermon, from Mount Mizar.
Deep calls to deep at the sound of Your waterfalls;
All Your breakers and Your waves have rolled over me. [...] Why are you in despair, O my soul?
And why have you become disturbed within me?
Hope in God, for I shall yet praise Him,
The help of my countenance and my God.” (NASB.)

Psalm 43:5: “Why are you in despair, O my soul?
And why are you disturbed within me?
Hope in God, for I shall again praise Him,
The help of my countenance and my God.” (NASB.)

Psalm 44:25: “For our soul has sunk down into the dust;
Our body cleaves to the earth.” (NASB.)

Psalm 51:6, 10: “Behold, You desire truth in the innermost being,
And in the hidden part You will make me know wisdom. [...] Create in me a clean heart, O God,
And renew a steadfast spirit within me.” (NASB.)

Psalm 56:13: “For You have delivered my soul from death,
Indeed my feet from stumbling,
So that I may walk before God
In the light of the living.” (NASB.)

Psalm 57:1, 6: “Be gracious to me, O God, be gracious to me,
For my soul takes refuge in You;
And in the shadow of Your wings I will take refuge
Until destruction passes by. [...] They have prepared a net for my steps;
My soul is bowed down;
They dug a pit before me;
They themselves have fallen into the midst of it. Selah.” (NASB.)

Psalm 62:1, 5: “My soul waits in silence for God only;
From Him is my salvation. [...] My soul, wait in silence for God only,
For my hope is from Him.” (NASB.)

Psalm 63:1, 5, 8: “O God, You are my God; I shall seek You earnestly;
My soul thirsts for You, my flesh yearns for You,
In a dry and weary land where there is no water. [...] My soul is satisfied as with marrow and fatness,
And my mouth offers praises with joyful lips. [...] My soul clings to You;
Your right hand upholds me.” (NASB.)

Psalm 69:10, 18: “When I wept in my soul with fasting,
It became my reproach. [...] Oh draw near to my soul and redeem it;
Ransom me because of my enemies!” (NASB.)

Psalm 71:23: “My lips will shout for joy when I sing praises to You;
And my soul, which You have redeemed.” (NASB.)

Psalm 77:2, 3, 6: “In the day of my trouble I sought the Lord;
In the night my hand was stretched out [a]without weariness;
My soul refused to be comforted.
When I remember God, then I am disturbed;
When I sigh, then my spirit grows faint. Selah. [...] I will remember my song in the night;
I will meditate with my heart,
And my spirit ponders:” (NASB.)

Psalm 78:8: “And not be like their fathers,
A stubborn and rebellious generation,
A generation that did not prepare its heart
And whose spirit was not faithful to God.” (NASB.)

Psalm 84:2: “My soul longed and even yearned for the courts of the LORD;
My heart and my flesh sing for joy to the living God.” (NASB.)

Psalm 86:4: “Make glad the soul of Your servant,
For to You, O Lord, I lift up my soul.” (NASB.)

Psalm 94:19: “When my anxious thoughts multiply within me,
Your consolations delight my soul.” (NASB.)

Psalm 103:1-2, 22: “Bless the LORD, O my soul,
And all that is within me, bless His holy name.
Bless the LORD, O my soul,
And forget none of His benefits; [...] Bless the LORD, all you works of His,
In all places of His dominion;
Bless the LORD, O my soul!” (NASB.)

Psalm 104:1, 35: “Bless the LORD, O my soul!
O LORD my God, You are very great;
You are clothed with splendor and majesty, [...] Let sinners be consumed from the earth
And let the wicked be no more
Bless the LORD, O my soul
Praise the LORD!” (NASB.)

Psalm 107:18, 26: “Their soul abhorred all kinds of food,
And they drew near to the gates of death. [...] They rose up to the heavens, they went down to the depths;
Their soul melted away in their misery.” (NASB.)

Psalm 116:7-8: “Return to your rest, O my soul,
For the LORD has dealt bountifully with you.
For You have rescued my soul from death,
My eyes from tears,
My feet from stumbling.” (NASB.)

Psalm 119:20, 25, 28, 81, 129, 167, 175: “My soul is crushed with longing
After Your ordinances at all times. [...] My soul cleaves to the dust;
Revive me according to Your word. [...] My soul weeps because of grief;
Strengthen me according to Your word. [...] My soul languishes for Your salvation;
I wait for Your word. [...] Your testimonies are wonderful;
Therefore my soul observes them. [...] My soul keeps Your testimonies,
And I love them exceedingly. [...] Let my soul live that it may praise You,
And let Your ordinances help me.” (NASB.)

Psalm 123:4: “Our soul is greatly filled
With the scoffing of those who are at ease,
And with the contempt of the proud.” (NASB.)

Psalm 130:5-6: “I wait for the LORD, my soul does wait,
And in His word do I hope.
My soul waits for the Lord
More than the watchmen for the morning;
Indeed, more than the watchmen for the morning.” (NASB.)

Psalm 131:2: “Surely I have composed and quieted my soul;
Like a weaned child rests against his mother,
My soul is like a weaned child within me.” (NASB.)

Psalm 138:3: “On the day I called, You answered me;
You made me bold with strength in my soul.” (NASB.)

Psqalm 139:14: “I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
And my soul knows it very well.” (NASB.)

Psalm 142:3, 7: “When my spirit was overwhelmed within me,
You knew my path
In the way where I walk
They have hidden a trap for me. [...] Bring my soul out of prison,
So that I may give thanks to Your name;
The righteous will surround me,
For You will deal bountifully with me.” (NASB.)

Psalm 143:3-4, 6-8: “For the enemy has persecuted my soul;
He has crushed my life to the ground;
He has made me dwell in dark places, like those who have long been dead.
Therefore my spirit is overwhelmed within me;
My heart is appalled within me. [...] I stretch out my hands to You;
My soul longs for You, as a parched land. Selah.
Answer me quickly, O LORD, my spirit fails;
Do not hide Your face from me,
Or I will become like those who go down to the pit.
Let me hear Your lovingkindness in the morning;
For I trust in You;
Teach me the way in which I should walk;
For to You I lift up my soul.” (NASB.)

Psalm 146:1: “Praise the LORD!
Praise the LORD, O my soul!” (NASB.)

Proverbs 2:10: “For wisdom will enter your heart
And knowledge will be pleasant to your soul;” (NASB.)

Proverbs 3:21-22: “My son, let them not vanish from your sight;
Keep sound wisdom and discretion,
So they will be life to your soul
And adornment to your neck.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 11:17: “The merciful man does good for his own soul,
But he who is cruel troubles his own flesh.” (NKJV.)

Proverbs 11:30: “The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life,
And he who is wise wins souls.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 13:19: “Desire realized is sweet to the soul,
But it is an abomination to fools to turn away from evil.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 15:4, 13: “A soothing tongue is a tree of life,
But perversion in it crushes the spirit. [...] A joyful heart makes a cheerful face,
But when the heart is sad, the spirit is broken.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 16:24, 32: “Pleasant words are a honeycomb,
Sweet to the soul and healing to the bones. [...] He who is slow to anger is better than the mighty,
And he who rules his spirit, than he who captures a city.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 18:14: “The spirit of a man can endure his sickness,
But as for a broken spirit who can bear it?” (NASB.)

Proverbs 20:27, 30: “The spirit of man is the lamp of the LORD,
Searching all the innermost parts of his being. [...] Stripes that wound scour away evil,
And strokes reach the innermost parts.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 21:10: “The soul of the wicked desires evil;
His neighbor finds no favor in his eyes.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 23:7: “For as he hath thought in his soul, so [is] he, ‘Eat and drink,’ saith he to thee, And his heart [is] not with thee.” (YLT.)

Proverbs 24:12-14: “If you say, ‘See, we did not know this,’
Does He not consider it who weighs the hearts?
And does He not know it who keeps your soul?
And will He not render to man according to his work?
My son, eat honey, for it is good,
Yes, the honey from the comb is sweet to your taste;
Know that wisdom is thus for your soul;
If you find it, then there will be a future,
And your hope will not be cut off.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 25:13, 28: “Like the cold of snow in the time of harvest
Is a faithful messenger to those who send him,
For he refreshes the soul of his masters. [...] Like a city that is broken into and without walls
Is a man who has no control over his spirit.” (NASB.)

Proverbs 28:25: “Whoso is proud in soul stirreth up contention, And whoso is trusting on Jehovah is made fat.” (YLT.)

Proverbs 29:17: “Correct your son, and he will give you comfort;
He will also delight your soul.” (NASB.)

Ecclesiastes 3:21: “Who knows whether the spirit of man goes upward and the spirit of the beast goes down into the earth?” (ESV.)

Ecclesiastes 6:2-3, 9: “a man to whom God has given riches and wealth and honor so that his soul lacks nothing of all that he desires; yet God has not empowered him to eat from them, for a foreigner enjoys them. This is vanity and a severe affliction.
If a man fathers a hundred children and lives many years, however many they be, but his soul is not satisfied with good things and he does not even have a proper burial, then I say, ‘Better the miscarriage than he, [...] What the eyes see is better than what the soul desires. This too is futility and a striving after wind.” (NASB.)

Ecclesiastes 7:8-9, 27-28: “Better is the end of a thing than its beginning,
and the patient in spirit is better than the proud in spirit.
Be not quick in your spirit to become angry,
for anger lodges in the bosom of fools. [...] Behold, this is what I found, says the Preacher, while adding one thing to another to find the scheme of things— which my soul has sought repeatedly, but I have not found. One man among a thousand I found, but a woman among all these I have not found.” (ESV.)

Ecclesiastes 8:8: “No one has power over the spirit to retain the spirit,
And no one has power in the day of death.
There is no release from that war,
And wickedness will not deliver those who are given to it.” (NKJV.)

Song of Solomon 1:7: “‘Tell me, O you whom my soul loves,
Where do you pasture your flock,
Where do you make it lie down at noon?
For why should I be like one who veils herself
Beside the flocks of your companions?’” (NASB.)

Song of Solomon 3:1-4: “‘On my bed night after night I sought him
Whom my soul loves;
I sought him but did not find him.
‘I must arise now and go about the city;
In the streets and in the squares
I must seek him whom my soul loves.’
I sought him but did not find him.
‘The watchmen who make the rounds in the city found me,
And I said, ‘Have you seen him whom my soul loves?’
‘Scarcely had I left them
When I found him whom my soul loves;
I held on to him and would not let him go
Until I had brought him to my mother’s house,
And into the room of her who conceived me.’” (NASB.)

Song of Solomon 5:6: “I opened to my beloved,
but my beloved had turned and gone.
My soul failed me when he spoke. I sought him, but found him not;
I called him, but he gave no answer.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 10:18: “And He will destroy the glory of his forest and of his fruitful garden, both soul and body,
And it will be as when a sick man wastes away.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 15:4: “Heshbon and Elealeh also cry out,
Their voice is heard all the way to Jahaz;
Therefore the armed men of Moab cry aloud;
His soul trembles within him.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 19:10: “And the pillars of Egypt will be crushed;
All the hired laborers will be grieved in soul.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 26:8-9: “Indeed, while following the way of Your judgments, O LORD,
We have waited for You eagerly;
Your name, even Your memory, is the desire of our souls.
At night my soul longs for You,
Indeed, my spirit within me seeks You diligently;
For when the earth experiences Your judgments
The inhabitants of the world learn righteousness.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 38:12-13, 15-16: “Like a shepherd’s tent my dwelling is pulled up and removed from me;
As a weaver I rolled up my life
He cuts me off from the loom;
From day until night You make an end of me.
I composed my soul until morning.
Like a lion--so He breaks all my bones,
From day until night You make an end of me. [...] What shall I say?
For He has spoken to me, and He Himself has done it;
I will wander about all my years because of the bitterness of my soul.
O Lord, by these things men live,
And in all these is the life of my spirit;
O restore me to health and let me live!” (NASB.)

Isaiah 42:5 “Thus says God the LORD,
Who created the heavens and stretched them out,
Who spread out the earth and its offspring,
Who gives breath to the people on it
And spirit to those who walk in it,” (NASB.)

Isaiah 53:11-12: “Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see and be satisfied;by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant,
make many to be accounted righteous,
and he shall bear their iniquities.
Therefore I will divide him a portion with the many,
and he shall divide the spoil with the strong,
because he poured out his soul to death
and was numbered with the transgressors;
yet he bore the sin of many,
and makes intercession for the transgressors.” (ESV.)

Isaiah 55:2-3: “Why do you spend money for what is not bread,
And your wages for what does not satisfy?
Listen carefully to Me, and eat what is good,
And let your soul delight itself in abundance.
Incline your ear, and come to Me.
Hear, and your soul shall live;
And I will make an everlasting covenant with you—
The sure mercies of David.” (NKJV.)

Isaiah 57:15-16: “For thus says the high and exalted One
Who lives forever, whose name is Holy,
‘I dwell on a high and holy place,
And also with the contrite and lowly of spirit
In order to revive the spirit of the lowly
And to revive the heart of the contrite.
‘For I will not contend forever,
Nor will I always be angry;
For the spirit would grow faint before Me,
And the breath of those whom I have made.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 61:10: “I will rejoice greatly in the LORD,
My soul will exult in my God;
For He has clothed me with garments of salvation,
He has wrapped me with a robe of righteousness,
As a bridegroom decks himself with a garland,
And as a bride adorns herself with her jewels.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 65:14: “Behold, My servants will shout joyfully with a glad heart,
But you will cry out with a heavy heart,
And you will wail with a broken spirit.” (NASB.)

Isaiah 66:3: “‘But he who kills an ox is like one who slays a man;
He who sacrifices a lamb is like the one who breaks a dog’s neck;
He who offers a grain offering is like one who offers swine’s blood;
He who burns incense is like the one who blesses an idol
As they have chosen their own ways,
And their soul delights in their abominations,” (NASB.)

Continued in next post...

Jeremy

Hark! The herald angels sing,
“Glory to the newborn King;
Peace on earth, and mercy mild,
God and sinners reconciled!”
Joyful, all ye nations rise,
Join the triumph of the skies;
With th’angelic host proclaim,
“Christ is born in Bethlehem!”

Refrain

Hark! the herald angels sing,
“Glory to the newborn King!”

Christ, by highest Heav’n adored;
Christ the everlasting Lord;
Late in time, behold Him come,
Offspring of a virgin’s womb.
Veiled in flesh the Godhead see;
Hail th’incarnate Deity,
Pleased with us in flesh to dwell,
Jesus our Emmanuel.

Refrain

Hail the heav’nly Prince of Peace!
Hail the Sun of Righteousness!
Light and life to all He brings,
Ris’n with healing in His wings.
Mild He lays His glory by,
Born that man no more may die.
Born to raise the sons of earth,
Born to give them second birth.

--http://nethymnal.org/htm/h/h/a/hhangels.htm

The truths of this song clearly refute several SDA teachings. In fact, the SDAs seem to have recognized this. Today I was disgusted to find (although I had known this before) that the SDAs, in the official SDA Hymnal, have (as they’ve done with many other hymns) completely changed the wording (since they defend EGW’s plagiarism, I guess they also have no problem with “reverse plagiarism”!). In the official SDA Hymnal, they have totally deleted the references to Jesus’ full deity in the second verse of this carol, and replaced those lines with other words. Here is the song as it appears in the SDA Hymnal:

1
Hark! the herald angels sing,
“Glory to the new born King,
peace on earth, and mercy mild,
God and sinners reconciled!”
Joyful, all ye nations rise,
join the triumph of the skies;
with th’ angelic host proclaim,
“Christ is born in Bethlehem!”
Hark! the herald angels sing,
“Glory to the new born King!”

2
Christ, by highest heaven adored;
Christ, the everlasting Lord;
in the manger born a king,
while adoring angels sing,
“Peace on earth, to men good will;”
bid the trembling soul be still,
Christ on earth has come to dwell,
Jesus, our Immanuel!
Hark! the herald angels sing,
“Glory to the newborn King!”

3
Hail the heaven-born Prince of Peace!
Hail the Sun of Righteousness!
Light and life to all he brings,
risen with healing in his wings.
Mild he lays his glory by,
born that we no more may die,
born to raise us from the earth,
born to give us second birth.
Hark! the herald angels sing,
“Glory to the new born King!”

--http://www.digitalhymnal.org/dhymn.cfm?hymnNumber=122

Notice how they have changed the two lines:

“Veiled in flesh the Godhead see;
Hail th’incarnate Deity,”

to

“‘Peace on earth, to men good will;’
bid the trembling soul be still,”

This is beyond despicable--but should not be too shocking, since Adventism simply rejects the teaching contained in those lines. (By the way, the LDS hymnal simply leaves out the second verse.)

If Adventism actually believes in the full deity of Christ (that He is the only true God), then why would they carefully delete such references from their Hymnal?

But those aren’t the only changes they made to this hymn. Notice that they also changed:

“Late in time, behold Him come,
Offspring of a virgin’s womb.
[...]
Pleased with us in flesh to dwell,”

to

“in the manger born a king,
while adoring angels sing,
[...]
Christ on earth has come to dwell,”

In other words, due to their Gnostic/Nestorian beliefs, they get rid of the fact that Christ actually became a man and has come in the flesh (one person--Jesus Christ--with two inseparable natures, divine and human).

And then, in the last three lines of the third verse, they change:

“Born that man no more may die.
Born to raise the sons of earth,
Born to give them second birth.”

to

“born that we no more may die,
born to raise us from the earth,
born to give us second birth.”

(Changes in bold.)

Here, for the third verse, they use an alternate version, so that they can speak of the resurrection (actually “re-creation") of the righteous instead of the new birth (being born again). Since they teach that the promise of Jesus ("everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die"--John 11:26 NASB) is actually “the devil’s first lie"--they can’t have “that man no more may die” be referring to the new birth!

One way to see what Adventism really teaches is to simply look at what they do with the lyrics of the classic hymns of the Christian faith.

And they simply refuse to accept Jesus as the one true God.

Jeremy

Here is a beautiful song called “The Gospel of Grace”

http://www.reformedpraise.org/index.php?p=659

There are a lot of other wonderful God glorifying songs to listen to.

Soli Deo Gloria!

Stan

Anyway, I have been reading his book “A Layman Looks at the Lord’s Prayer” for worship with my students and have been blessed and challenged by it. I thought I’d share this part of his analysis of the phrase “For Thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory for ever and ever” I think we see much of not only different aspects of Adventism in the following words, but most of Christendom too. I hope you are blessed by it as well!

There are some who attempt to live their Christian lives out of a sense of duty to God. It cannot be done. It becomes a dreadful burden and bondage. There are others who endeavor to maintain their relationship to God by ritual and routine. This degenerates to awful boredom. Still others hope to live in spiritual communication with God by indulging in emotional, ecastatic experiences. These are delusive and temporary., A few struggle resolutely to live stoicly with great self-discipline and inner determination of spirit. They grow weary in their well doing.

But for the soul who understands something of the wonderous goodness of his Father in heaven, who feels his heart warmed by genuine gratitude for the generosity of God, who feels appreciation and love welling up within because of his Father’s love, such a soul has found the secret to a serene and enduring relationship with his God. This is forever, unchanging, undiminished!

Such a person now discovers that the motivation, the drives, the desires which now determine his relationship to God and others are not those of his or her own making. They have their origin with God. Their source is the Person of God Himself. In other words, we love because He first loved us

Merry Christmas to all!

Here is a most inspiring prayer from the Puritan’s prayer book “Valley of Vision”

The Gift of Gifts

“O SOURCE OF ALL GOOD,
What shall I render thee for the gift of gifts,
thine own dear Son, begotten, not created,
my redeemer, proxy, surety, substitute,
his self-emptying incomprehensible,
his infinity of love beyond the heart’s grasp.

Herein is wonder of wonders:
he came below to raise me above,
was born like me that I might become like him.
Herein is love:
when I cannot rise to him he draws near on wings of grace,
to raise me to himself.
Herein is power;
when Deity and humanity were infinitely apart
he united them in indissoluble unity, the uncreated and the created.
Herein is wisdom;
when I was undone, with no will to return to him,
and no intellect to devise recovery,
he came, God-incarnate, to save me to the uttermost,
as man to die my death
to shed satisfying blood on my behalf,
to work out a perfect righteousness for me.

O God, take me in spirit to watchful shepherds, and
enlarge my mind;
let me hear good tidings of great joy,
and hearing, believe, rejoice, praise, adore,
my conscience bathed in an ocean of repose,
my eyes lifted to a reconciled Father;
place me with ox, ass, camel, goat,
to look with them upon my redeemer’s face,
and in him account myself delivered from sin;
let me with Simeon clasp the new-born child to my heart,
embrace him with undying faith,
exulting that he is mine and I am his.
In him thou hast given me so much that heaven can give no more.”
-------------------------------------------------------------

This is the true message of Christmas.

Stan

What caught my eye was the last paragraph of Phil Johnson’s post that reads as follows:

Why is Dr. Millet nonetheless courting evangelical acceptance?

I have no way of knowing whether Dr. Millet’s meticulous attempt to reconcile Mormon doctrine with certain evangelical ideas and terminology reflects an authentic interest in better understanding the biblical principle of grace—or a carefully-crafted PR campaign to gain mainstream acceptance for Mormonism. I wish I could believe it is the former. It has all the earmarks of the latter. After all, a few other cults and “-isms” have already successfully mainstreamed themselves by simply appealing to the ever-broadening evangelical consensus. Most of the books that ever treated Seventh-Day Adventism as a cult are now deemed out of date and unsophisticated. Roman Catholicism has sought and received the evangelical imprimatur from dozens of key evangelical leaders in recent years. Even the Worldwide Church of God—a cult that was virtually a monument to one man’s ability to assimilate almost any heresy into one elaborate labyrinth of spiritual mischief—sought and received widespread evangelical acceptance by tweaking their beliefs and adopting evangelical terminology, but without ever formally renouncing their founder’s religion as false. After a decade-long public-relations campaign, the WWCOG has still not settled into a truly evangelical doctrinal position, but they have nevertheless found warm acceptance from the evangelical mainstream. Hey, if it worked for them, why shouldn’t the Mormons try it, too?
Source: Latter-Day Ecumenism

Thoughts?

Greg

Nate

Gerhard Pfandle, the author of the series of studies, seems to be aware that one of the highly important objection raised by critics has to do with the Ellen White’s denial of the assurance of salvation which protestants always believed, in opposition with the Roman Catholic justification by faith plus works.

Here is his answer to the critique. First, he quotes from Ellen White:

“There is nothing so offensive to God or so dangerous to the human soul as pride and self-sufficiency. Of all sins it is the most hopeless, the most incurable. Peter’s fall was not instantaneous, but gradual. Self-confidence led him to the belief that he was saved, and step after step was taken in the downward path, until he could deny his Master. Never can we safely put confidence in self or feel, this side of heaven, that we are secure against temptation. Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or to feel that they are saved. This is misleading. Every one should be taught to cherish hope and faith; but even when we give ourselves to Christ and know that He accepts us, we are not beyond the reach of temptation.” —Ellen G. White, Christ’s Object Lessons, pp. 154, 155.

So far, so good, now comes Pfandle’s question:

Look at the whole context of the Ellen White quote above. Now look at the one statement about not saying we are saved. How easy to take that one statement out of context and come away with a whole different meaning from what was intended. Why must we always be careful not to pull statements out of context? What other examples can you find of people having done just that? Why is it such a temptation?

Pfandle is right that we should look at the whole context. His basic argument is this. It’s easy to pull statements out of context, construct a straw man which can be easily shot. Pfandle implies that critics of Ellen White are not willing to see that all that Ellen White is not denying assurance of salvation per se, but she’s condemning the sin of presumption. She’s only warning people about the real possibility of failing to temptations and lose the battle.

Unfortunately, both Ellen and Pfandle assume that protestants based their assurance of salvation on the wrong assumption of immunity regarding sin and temptation. Of course, if it is put in this way, it sounds ridiculous to argue for having full assurance of your salvation when even some true believers as Peter had their period of apostasy or departure from Christ, denial of Christ. It should be above all reasonable doubt that a true believer can fail, can deny Christ, can become apostate.

Fortunately, the reformers had a better view, expressed in the P from TULIP, one of the five points of Calvinism. P stands for Perseverance of the saints, the doctrine which states the biblical fact that true believers, even if they may fall for a time, will be restored by God’s powerful and sovereign grace to a state of holiness. They acknowledged the possibility of apostasy, and at the same time God’s promise that this apostasy is not full neither final. The outcome, the salvation of the soul, is sure, even if, in God’s purposes, his elect may seem to fall from faith definitively.

Here are some articles dealing with the perseverance of the saints from the Synod of Dort

Article 4
Although the weakness of the flesh cannot prevail against the power of God, who confirms and preserves true believers in a state of grace, yet converts are not always so influenced and actuated by the Spirit of God as not in some particular instances sinfully to deviate from the guidance of divine grace, so as to be seduced by and to comply with the lusts of the flesh; they must, therefore, be constant in watching and prayer, that they may not be led into temptation. When these are neglected, they are not only liable to be drawn into great and heinous sins by the flesh, the world, and Satan, but sometimes by the righteous permission of God actually are drawn into these evils. This, the lamentable fall of David, Peter, and other saints described in Holy Scripture, demonstrates.

Article 5
By such enormous sins, however, they very highly offend God, incur a deadly guilt, grieve the Holy Spirit, interrupt the exercise of faith, very grievously wound their consciences, and sometimes for a while lose the sense of God’s favor, until, when they change their course by serious repentance, the light of God’s fatherly countenance again shines upon them.

Article 6
But God, who is rich in mercy, according to His unchangeable purpose of election, does not wholly withdraw the Holy Spirit from His own people even in their grievous falls; nor suffers them to proceed so far as to lose the grace of adoption and forfeit the state of justification, or to commit the sin unto death or against the Holy Spirit; nor does He permit them to be totally deserted, and to plunge themselves into everlasting destruction.

Article 7
For in the first place, in these falls He preserves in them the incorruptible seed of regeneration from perishing or being totally lost; and again, by His Word and Spirit He certainly and effectually renews them to repentance, to a sincere and godly sorrow for their sins, that they may seek and obtain remission in the blood of the Mediator, may again experience the favor of a reconciled God, through faith adore His mercies, and henceforward more diligently work out their own salvation with fear and trembling.

Article 8
Thus it is not in consequence of their own merits or strength, but of God’s free mercy, that they neither totally fall from faith and grace nor continue and perish finally in their backslidings; which, with respect to themselves is not only possible, but would undoubtedly happen; but with respect to God, it is utterly impossible, since His counsel cannot be changed nor His promise fail; neither can the call according to His purpose be revoked, nor the merit, intercession, and preservation of Christ be rendered ineffectual, nor the sealing of the Holy Spirit be frustrated or obliterated.

The Article 8 is very important, and presents clearly the fact that there are two perspectives: when man is in view, man as it is in himself, falling from faith, falling from grace, perishing finally is not only possibly, it is a sure thing ("but would undoubtedly happen"). But from the other perspective, with respect to God, that’s impossible. These two perspectives account for what otherwise look as internal contradictions in the Bible: texts which warn believers regarding the danger of apostasy, on one side; on the other, texts which assure believers that God will not loose one sheep, nobody being able to snatch them from His hand (John 10).

The difference between a true believer and a false one is that the true believer will persevere until the end, because God’s sovereign grace restores him to repentance and faith, and a false believer will not persevere until the end. At the surface, both an false and a true believer may give in to temptations, may go on the same paths, but one of them will repent of his sins and one not.

In dialogues with Adventists I usually hear the objection “Why believers are warned against the danger of unbelief if their salvation is not in jeopardy?” The answer is that the danger of apostasy is real and it may occur for a time, but God uses the warnings in order to keep his saints on the right track. If the hearer is a true believer, God’s warning is part of God’s sovereign grace exercised through the Holy Spirit in order to preserve his saints on the right track.

That’s the reason Peter says

Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall. 2 Peter 1:10

Peter is not implying that our election depends on our ability to make it sure, and if we are not able, we will lose our salvation. Taking his words in this way will put himself in contradiction with Jesus’ words “No one is able to snatch them [My sheep] from my hand.” His target is to prevent the situation described in Article 5 quoted above

By such enormous sins, however, they very highly offend God, incur a deadly guilt, grieve the Holy Spirit, interrupt the exercise of faith, very grievously wound their consciences, and sometimes for a while lose the sense of God’s favor, until, when they change their course by serious repentance, the light of God’s fatherly countenance again shines upon them.

He wants people to have strong faith and don’t lose the sense of God’s favor. he wants them to see continually God’s fatherly countenance shining upon them. He wants them to have assurance of faith, and grievous sin is an efficient killer of assurance of God’s favor.

Of course, even in this state, the believer does not lose the grace of justification. But from his subjective perspective, his experience is similar to what a false believer experiences also. In these moments, only pure grace can save his soul. Everything in himself screams that he’s a sinner without any hope of salvation. He’s aware of his total failure of persevering in faith, but, as some good pastors from White Horse Inn said, he must learn the lesson that the gospel can save even Christians, or wretched Christians, ungodly Christians. He knows that the gospel can save poor sinners, but how about Christians who made a mess of God AFTER they trusted in Jesus for their justification? Is the gospel for these ungodly also? Is God also in the busyness of justifying ungodly persons?

Back to the initial theme: I’m sorry that neither Ellen White or Pfandle understood the gospel as it was discovered by the reformers. Consequently they are having nothing substantially to offer to hungry souls who are thirsty after God and righteousness, who are weak and weary above a mere hope. Hope that is based on people’s ability to keep themselves on the right track and in which periods of great trials and temptations, periods of doubt have often proved to be fatal for their souls.

What makes the situation dangerous is that Ellen White instilled a deep fear in people to trust God for their future salvation. As teaching that there is no guarantee for the future salvation is not bad enough, the idea was presented as blatant heresy, as a sin of presumption.

Admittedly there are many so-called evangelicals who preach a shallow gospel or a gospel which is Roman Catholic in essence. But instilling fears against the true gospel based on the highest authority, prophetic authority, making people look at the true gospel as it is the devil’s gospel raises the issues to a higher level. That’s why I’m deploring the official praise and enforcement of Ellen’s authority made by the church in this present SS Quarterly. Adding to this the specific rejection of full assurance of salvation endorsed by the assumed inspired words of Ellen White is one step further in the attempt, successfully to a higher degree, of making sure that the true gospel will be rejected.

Gabriel

http://progressiveadventism.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=66