Concerns of a Historic Adventist
Posted: 06 January 2007 12:20 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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Posted on the Abundant Rest blog is a letter from a concerned historic Adventist to the General Conference entitled ”33 Adventist Issues Presented to the General Conference.” Outlined in this two-page letter are dozens of concerns regarding the wayward direction of today’s Adventist church as seen by the writer, Jim Keesler.  The letter itself provides a view into the perceived foundational issues at the heart of historic Adventism, sounding a “battle cry” of sorts for those who believe the Adventist church has strayed from their historic roots.  Noticeably absent is any mention of the gospel or even a direct reference to Jesus, except to advocate a semi-Arian view of the trinity.  As Ron Corson notes over on Adventist Media Response and Conversation, the writer of this letter has confessed loyalty to a precursor of the Adventist fundamental beliefs compiled in 1872, which did not include a formal endorsement of Ellen White’s prophetic status. Sadly and somewhat ironically, the letter places a higher emphasis on her writings than the Bible.  The full letter is reproduced below, with some initial editorial observations interspersed throughout.

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February 25, 2006

Dear Friends,

I have been S.D.A. for some thirty years. During this time, not once have I contacted the Conference by phone or letter to complain or criticize - nor is this my wish now.

May I say that I believe:

1. The 25 fundamentals as taught by our early pioneers

2. The ministry of Ellen White

3. Health reform

4. Dress Reform

5. Sabbath reform

6. Christian recreation

7. True Christian education, etc.

And it is my desire and determination to teach these principles to others, and practice them by God’s grace, and His indwelling Holy Spirit.

[Ed: How about a desire to fulfill the gospel commission, making disciples of Jesus Christ?]

What is my concern?

1. Changes in our fundamental beliefs

2. Pastors and teachers who do not believe in the Spirit of Prophecy or our doctrines

3. Leaders and lay members alike who do not believe in health reform, dress reform, Sabbath reform, Christian recreation, or true Christian education, etc.

Here are some examples:

The Bible and Spirit of Prophecy teach plainly what is to be our position on these points, and yet -

[Ed: Notice how the Spirit of Prophecy (Ellen White’s writings) are placed on par with the Bible]

1. Many among God’s professed people are still using coffee, tea, cola drinks, meat, milk, eggs, and cheese (James 4:17).

[Ed: James 4:17 says nothing about foods: “So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.” The author clearly believes Ellen White’s writings detail “the right thing to do,” but unfortunately these food prohibitions fly in the face of Scripture (Mark 7:14-23, Romans 14:14, Acts 10:10-15, 1 Timothy 4:1-5, 1 Corinthians 10:23-33).]

2. There is a lack of reverence in the sanctuary; with eating, drinking, clapping, gossip (Mathew 18:15), and worldly conversation (like being at a picnic), coming to church dressed for a ballgame, and with some of the girls/women dressed in such a way that could cause their brothers in Christ to stumble morally (Leviticus 19:30).

[Ed: How about the Psalms advocating dancing to the Lord and praising God with instruments and drums? (Psalm 149:3)]

3. Going to school, or out to eat on the Sabbath (Exodus 20:10).

4. Getting involved in politics, labor unions, or secret societies.

5. Having a church manual.

6. Wearing wedding rings, makeup, and jewelry.

7. Dancing, theater going, card playing, and reading novels.

8. Drama and mime in church.

9. Seeking worldly education, or accreditation for our schools.

10. Earning or conferring Degrees.

11. Use of, or prescribing drugs; Upon request, offering pork in our hospitals.

12. Abortion (6th commandment).

13. Yoking up with non-SDA hospitals (2 Corinthians 6:14).

14. Lawsuits (1 Corinthians 6, and GC 443). And who tricked the church into obtaining 501c3 status? This places the church under government sanction. And trade marking the name SDA? When the church incorporated, it switched from being a church to being a business.

15. Halloween and Christmas parties, participating in Easter sunrise services, and conducting regular Sunday church services.

16. Disfellowshipping faithful pastors and lay members, as well as whole churches and Conferences.

17. Competitive sports.

18. The Celebration Movement, NLP, worldly music, and the use of drama in church.

19. Ecumenism, pulpit swapping, membership in the WCC/NCC.

20. Changing our beliefs and standards through errors in the Sabbath school quarterlies.

21. Divorce and remarriage (Luke 16:18).

22. Tolerating homosexuality and adultery in the church (7th commandment).

23. Military service (violates the 4th and 6th commandments).

24. Improper use of tithe funds (like paying teacher salaries, investing in the stock market - a form of gambling, and buying shopping centers).

25. Women elders, women pastors, and women’s ordination (1 Timothy 3:2).

26. Practicing open communion.

27. Confusion over the 144,000, the nature of Christ, and the trinity (The trinity is a Roman Catholic teaching).

[Ed: Catholics believe Jesus Christ is the Messiah–shall we do away with that teaching too?  Jesus is the eternal Word (John 1:1-4), the exact imprint of God (Hebrews 1:1-4), sitting on the throne forever and ever (Hebrews 1:8), the Alpha and the Omega (Revelation 1:8) and Mighty God (Isaiah 9:6-7).]

28. Dozens of Roman Catholic references in the church hymnal.

29. Steeples on our churches (From sun worship).

30. Logo change. No one asked for - or got a vote of approval from me. (Our new church logo is on the floor at the Vatican).

[Ed: huh?]

31. Church structure and organization founded on a hierarchy like Roman Catholicism. Roman Catholics are sincere and precious (Rev. 18:14). Though having a Christian appearance, Roman Catholicism is largely derived from paganism, and much of the church’s teachings are based on tradition rather than scripture (Matthew 15:9).

[Ed: and much of historic Adventist teaching is based on Ellen White’s writings...]

32. Trashy books used as required reading or textbooks in our schools.

33. Promoting books of a “new order” such as those written by Morris Venden, and others. And just as washing his hands before the people did not cleanse Pilot from the blood of Jesus, placing a disclaimer in the front of new books does not remove responsibility from our printing establishments of producing sound, truth-filled literature.

What are we if we do something that we do not believe, or believe something that we do not do? According to Revelation 12:17 and Revelation 19:10, the remnant are those who keep the commandments and follow the Spirit of Prophecy counsel. My conclusion? The denomination is no longer Seventh-day Adventist.

(Signed) Jim Keesler

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Reading this letter saddens me, because it’s clear Jim is earnest in his beliefs, yet his beliefs are fixated on anything but Jesus and the gospel.  Moreover, the focus of the letter is on being a “true Adventist,” to the exclusion of being a “true Christian.”

As long as historic Adventists place so much emphasis on dietary practices, outward appearances, and trying to avoid any doctrinal agreement with Roman Catholics, they run the risk of missing the gospel and the righteousness that is in Jesus Christ alone as revealed in the Scriptures, which are necessary and sufficient to make one wise for salvation (2 Timothy 3:14-15) without the aid of extra-biblical prophetic assistance.

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Posted: 05 January 2007 09:44 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Alrighty then...let’s also go back to wearing suits and petticoats and bring back the horse and buggy while we’re at it.

In my opinion, this person might have a biblical basis for protesting numbers 12, 21, 22, and 23. But he makes this sound like it is practically on the church books inscribed in the fundamentals. It is a little extreme to think that the church as a whole practices or endorses such things.

The rest isn’t even worth mentioning.

I guess it all depends on one’s view of salvation. If we believe that eating meat will do you in to hell should you die after doing so, then all of these ‘standards’ are tantamount to salvational issues.

This is where many in the SDA church come to meaningless Pharisaism and cultic thinking. 

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Posted: 05 January 2007 12:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Guibox, I think we’re basically in agreement on this letter.  smile

Greg

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Posted: 09 January 2007 12:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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An official response to this letter from the GC has been posted here: http://abundantrest.org/2007/01/04/james-cress-responds-to-adventist-issues-letter/

Greg

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Posted: 13 January 2007 08:13 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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Posted anonymously by: The Historic Adventist

I don’t think anyone is asking for a return to the Amish style of religious living ... that is a bit separatist from the world.  However, what I do think the author is looking for is something that is more concrete in what we believe.  Take, for example, the doctrine of 1844 and the investigative judgment.  If we no longer believe in this doctrine, then 1844 becomes a face-saving relic of the past.  This is one of our few distinctive doctrines.  Next, take the regard for the inspiration of the Spirit of Prophecy.  If we disregard the counsels to the church and the inspired commentary on the scriptures, then we reject God’s messenger to His people ... or were we just wrong for 70+ years? 

I guess it is my thought that truth is truth, no matter how old it becomes.  The truth doesn’t change.  Are these salvation issues?  No ... salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not of works.  There is nothing we can do to earn our salvation.  But what is salvation?  Isn’t there supposed to be a change where all the old things pass away and all things become new?  Aren’t we supposed to be new creatures in Christ Jesus?  Doesn’t John tell us that if we say we love God but don’t obey His word that we are liars and the truth is not in us?  This is strong meat to bear, but the reality is harsh:  broad is the way that leads to destruction and narrow is the way that leads to righteousness.  Jesus doesn’t ask much of us for salvation ... all we have to is give our ALL ... take up our cross DAILY, and FOLLOW HIM.

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Posted: 13 January 2007 09:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Historic SDA,

Welcome to 4TG--glad you are here.

You raise some excellent points. I always have believed that historic or traditional SDAs are very concerned about absolute truth, just as other evangelical Christians are.

The question I had to ask myself when I was born again back in 1982 was: Can the doctrine of Christ going into the second apartment of the sanctuary in 1844 to start an Investigative Judgment be reconciled with the clearest scriptures in the book of Hebrews? I was concerned, because for Ellen White’s prophetic gift to be valid, then a key vision or doctrine of the SDA church could not contradict the clearest scriptures.

Hebrews 9 and Hebrews 10 are very clear about Christ entering the Holiest once for all and sitting down at the right hand of God, which occurred at His ascension.

I will have more time to develop this and discuss this later, and we welcome a dialogue from you on this topic.

Stan

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Posted: 13 January 2007 04:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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Historic Adventist, I echo Stan’s warm welcome above.

Concerning your premise about rejecting one of the few distinctive doctrines of Adventism in rejecting the investigative judgment, I hope you will agree that we should test everything by the Bible.  It’s a bitter pill to swallow to be sure, but it is far better to measure our beliefs by the Scriptures today rather than find out later we were blinded by our own desire not be wrong.

Greg

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Posted: 15 January 2007 02:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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Hebrews 9:11,12

11"But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come,[e] then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation) 12 HE ENTERED ONCE FOR ALL into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his OWN BLOOD, thus SECURING an eternal redemption."(Emphasis mine)
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This text is one of the strongest there is against the traditional SDA position. Des Ford said in one lecture, that when he was converted to SDA by Ellen White’s writings, he knew even as an early teen, that on reading Hebrews 9, there was no way that the traditional SDA position could stand. The force of the passage clearly states a finality to Christ’s work of redemption. Granted, He ever lives to make intercession, but the work of redemption was accomplished on Calvary’s cross.

Hebrews 10:11-14:

“And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12But when Christ had offered FOR ALL TIME a SINGLE SACRIFICE for sins, he SAT DOWN at the right hand of God, 13waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. 14For by a SINGLE OFFERING he has perfected for ALL TIME those who are being sanctified."(Emphasis mine)
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I don’t know how in light of the two above passages of scripture, the traditional view of 1844 and the sanctuary as taught by Ellen White could possibly be reconciled.

If Christ SAT DOWN at His ascension, and then waits for His enemies to become His footstool, then how can Ellen White have a vision that shows Christ STANDING UP again, and going into the second apartment in 1844? On what basis then can we believe that Ellen White received this vision from God?

We welcome your input The Historic Adventist, and we would love to dialogue on this issue.

Stan

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